Conditioner—love it or leave it?
The most surprising thing I discovered when I conducted my first focus group of Great Grays was that most of them had given up on conditioners. Many claimed they left their hair too flat, too limp, too lifeless. If you’ll go back to Care & Treatment, you’ll find out why. Certain conditioners are good for limp hair, others are better for hair with good body and thickness—you have to know what’s in them. But I’m curious. At a time when hair is becoming more fragile, more dry, and more lackluster, why on earth do some women shun conditioners? Do you like products that simply provide shine without the de-tangling benefits? Do you prefer pomades or topical spray-on oils? Do you like leave-in conditioners, rinse-out conditioners, or no conditioners at all? Tell us what you use to get the kind of shine, texture and manageability you like. We’d all like to know.
Posted by Diana Jewell on 12/06 at 03:27 PM
This is a great question and one with which I am still experimenting! So far (I am about 2/3 into the grow out phase) it looks just fine when I don’t condition. In fact since I stopped coloring my hair the new growth is much healthier looking and soft. Regular conditioning does seem to flatten it out. But after a lifetime of conditioning I am afraid to stop it completely when I read how gray is more fragile. So I don’t do it every time and use minimal product mostly on the ends where there’s still dyed hair. Open to suggestions!
Posted by morningstar on 12/10 at 05:01 PM
Hi Morningstar—welcome to the site! So let’s get to this conditioning thing. First, if you’ve gone to the Care & Treatment section, you’ve probably already read that conditioners containing silicone are ok for hair with good body and thickness. But if your hair tends to limp out, look for conditioners formulated with ceramides, instead. Both leave hair silkier and shining. It’s no wonder your new growth is healthier looking and soft. Coloring does damage hair over time—just ask me, an ex-"blonde." I also know what you mean about the habit of conditioning. When your growth gets longer, you’re going to want a de-tangler—mostly because you don’t want to stretch and snap the grays when you comb through your hair after washing. In the meantime, what you’re doing by conditioning just the damaged ends sounds good. You’re really soothing those dry, tired ends. But you’re not fortifying your fragile grays. So once a month, or once every three weeks, just give your hair a really good conditioning treatment—all over. Mostly, these are applied BEFORE you shampoo—like the Minardi Pre-Wash Therapy I talk about in “Fuzzy wuzzy was a hair.” If you can’t find it, look for similar pre-wash conditioners or serums that deliver really “do-good” ingredients—like strengthening polypeptides, panthenol, vitamins, moisturizers (see the anti-aging article—click on read more and you’ll find the do-gooders.) You won’t need to condition after a treatment like this. But every hair on your head will be happier! Try it for awhile, and let me know how it goes. D.
Posted by Diana Jewell on 12/10 at 05:46 PM
All great ideas! Now I just have to get going...will let you know how it goea. Thank you!
Posted by morningstar on 12/11 at 03:22 PM
Ok - better late than never? Looked for a good pre-wash therapy and decided to go with the gold! Contacted Minardi Salon in NYC because I didn’t have retailer close by. They contacted me within 24 hours and today I got my order! Thanks Diana
Posted by morningstar on 01/17 at 06:35 PM
Hey, welcome back! That’s great that you got it. You’ve probably noticed that I moved all the product info and the “anti-aging” products to a new section that you can get to right off the home page—Products You Should Know About. So keep checking there from time to time for more news, and let me know how you like the Minardi Pre-Wash Therapy. Diana
Posted by Diana Jewell on 01/17 at 09:53 PM
Tried the Minardi pre-wash this past weekend. Between that and finally getting a fortifying shampoo with ceramides...I think progress is defintely being made. More body, lasts longer and no droopy locks.
Diana - on average do you think the Minardi pre-wash is meant to be a once a month treatment? Or more often?
Posted by morningstar on 01/23 at 04:03 AM
Yup—you sound like you’re on your way. Glad you liked the treatment. Did you notice “bounce,” too? I did. The pre-wash is designed to be used every fourth time your hair is washed. Now, if those colored ends are EXTREMELY damaged, you can use it every other time. (There’s even a Minardi Afer Wash conditioner you can use, too, if it comes to that.) But only you know the health of your hair right now. If it’s responded so well to what you’ve been doing, go on the every fourth time schedule. And, eventually, you might even taper back from there. Hope this helps, D.
Posted by Diana Jewell on 01/23 at 10:50 AM
Hi ladies,
Just new to the site and having fun browsing around here...thought I’d put my two-cents worth in on this one. For most of my life hairstylists have told me not to condition often and not within two inches of my scalp because I have superfine hair. But...since I stopped dyeing my hair I have found that I must condition in order to have any shine, plus it seems to help with the crazy short (i.e. new) wiry hairs that are close to my part. It seems that maybe the dye was coating my hair before and giving it a bit of weight to keep these wild unpigmented hairs at bay. Now they’re out of control!
Anyway, I do what one of the stylists I’ve gone to recently does: towel dry and apply conditioner all over, comb through and rinse. And actually, I’m using up the many tubes of conditioner that I used to get in my home hair colour kits. They are pretty potent and I’m really frugal…
I love leave in conditioners though, as they save time. Anyone know of a good one??
Posted by newbie2 on 04/04 at 09:51 AM
I’m re-asking Newbie2’s question about a good leave-in conditioner. Diana mentions Ojon Leave-in Glossing Cream. Are there other good ones out there?
Posted by RunnerGal on 06/11 at 02:55 PM
hi- thought this should go in this thread...there’s a nice product from Origins called “Rich Rewards”...it’s a deep conditioner (I think)...smells great, gives good shine…
I usually put a ton on my hair on one of those at-home-cleaning-on-Saturday-spa-days and leave it in for hours..
Recently I tried taking just a little dab to use to keep down flyaway grays and it works well....
(the gibbons monkey made me write- since it’s my last name)
Helen 
Posted by Thisyear on 07/09 at 06:25 PM
Heeheee—wondered if that would get your attention! I love it that she’s got white hair! Maybe a bit too much of the smoky eye, however. 
Thanks for the tip—Rich Rewards certainly sounds like a product worth trying.
Posted by Diana Jewell on 07/09 at 06:40 PM
Hello ladies,
I am leaving saturday for a week in sunny Cuba for scubadiving.
It will be the first time since going gray I swim in the salted waters...any hair advice? I know pool water may make white hair yellow because of chlorine, but what about salted water?
Thanks!!!!
Posted by gardenmimine on 09/17 at 12:50 PM
I’ve tried just about everything, but since I’m transitioning faster now, I am experiencing more wiry non-compliant strands. So for the past three months I’ve been using products by Chaz Dean, WEN Sweet Almond Mint, and my hair feels and looks fabulous. It’s always had lots of body, but frizzes in humidity, but these products have absolutely been sensational. WEN’s not for everyone, but it’s been absolutely great for me. Every 2-3 months I switch off and alternate with Joico, Paul Mitchel or Biosilk products, but I’ll keep using WEN for my main conditioner until something better catches my attention.
Posted by saltnpeppa on 09/20 at 06:37 PM
I love conditioner.Here we dont have as many brands as in the us; but enough to get your hair in good health. This is what i do:i never wash my hair with shampoo, i only rinse with water.I am doing so for years, and have never limp dull hair.But i do condition with good conditioners!This is also cleaning your scalp and hair.My favourites are: kerastase,redken,biosilk,And always with moisterizers.
Posted by catweezle on 10/05 at 02:42 AM
Hi catweezie—You know, you’re not far wrong in never using shampoo. I read something in a Japanese journal that stated simply rinsing hair with warm water removes 90% of the grime. I found that amazing. I’d rather have a few solvents in there to bubble it all away, but that’s a personal choice. I also think using a shampoo specifically designed for a purpose—ie, a blue shampoo to counteract yellow, a dandruff shampoo, a restorative shampoo—whatever—brings some extra “bonuses” to the hair.
But everyone’s hair reacts differently. I’ve had people tell me they just use whatever bath gel they use on their body on their hair. Other people like 2-in-1 products combining a shampoo and a conditioner. Others skip conditioners altogether. In most cases, including just the warm water rinsing, this is very drying to hair. But not in all.
If you’ve found something that really works for your hair, that’s the best solution. I’d be horrified if you said you didn’t moisturize or condition your hair, but that’s where you spend your money. And that’s a very good thing! 
Posted by Diana Jewell on 10/05 at 08:38 AM
QVC sells a product by Chaz Dean called Wen. It has zero lathering agents that are supposedly the guilty ingredients that strip your hair of shine and moisture. This is a cleanser and conditioner in one. It’s too pricey for me, but I have read that Sally Beauty Supply stores carry a brand similar to this called Hair One. It is about one fourth of the price of Wen. I wondered if anyone has tried that on gray hair. You can read reviews on QVC.com and in thier community forum under Beauty Banter if you want to know more. I might try the Hair One someday, but I have so much stuff to use up first, and “waste not, want not,” you know. Jhirmack Silver is what I am using now. I don’t really see any difference though. It’s supposed to turbo boost the shine, but I don’t think it does. I also have a zillion of those tubes of conditioner left from the hair dye boxes. That’s good stuff, but I am not using it right now. I will eventually, as a deep conditioner maybe once a week with a hot towel wrapped around my head. I have thick, stubby, dry, coarse hair and as a Caucasian, that’s odd. It’s also stick straight. Love these forums; I get so many ideas.
Posted by rocksister on 10/08 at 09:48 AM
Hi Rocksister and Everybody,
When my hair is super short (1 inch or shorter) it is stick straight. But I found out that is because I have a lot of body in my hair. In fact it goes wavy with curls at the end. I think the weight of it pulls some of the curls and waves out.
I do use conditioner, but rinse my hair with cool/cold water and that seems to make it shinier. I, too, have lots of left over home dye conditioner and use it once a week. At this rate, I have enough conditioner for about six months! I also use a regular conditioner everyday.
Question concerning shampoo and conditioner for gray/silver hair: I have used Clairol Shimmer lights (didn’t seem to do anything) and Pantene Silver expressions which worked for awhile and then I didn’t notice any change. What do you all use? I use the Pantene set on one day, Suave Clairifying set on the second day, and finally Aussie Moist set on the third day. That’s my rotation.
Mary
Posted by mary on 10/18 at 08:11 AM
I’ve never commented on this thread, so just catching up some. I’m totally freaked out by not shampooing. I am the type who feels it completely necessary to shampoo, rinse, AND REPEAT! I know it’s a psychological thing with me, but I wash my hair every other day and think I need one shampoo per day. :o) I’ve come a long way, though. I used to use clarifying shampoos every day. (Would you believe in my teens I sometimes used Palmolive dish washing liquid! EEEK!) I wanted squeaky clean hair. So, yes. I was drying the life out of it. I now use good quality conditioning shampoos and it’s made a huge difference with my coarse hair.
I’m intrigued by WEN, but I just don’t like automatic shipments. I like complete control over when I buy. So, don’t know if I will ever try it. Interesting about the product from Sally’s. Maybe I’ll look into that one?
Mary - I use Aveda Blue Malva shampoo only twice a month to brighten the whites. Our dear Diana reminds us that they are drying to your hair, as are clarifying shampoos. So, they shouldn’t be used very often.
Just rinsing? I’m still trying to process this thought! :o)
Posted by greeneyes on 10/29 at 09:54 AM
I’m going to Sally’s this weekend and buy that Hair One product (WEN knock-off). I’ll report back after using it.
Posted by RunnerGal on 10/29 at 10:17 AM
Hi RunnerGal,
Yes, please let us know! I ordered WEN the other day but it is a bit pricey. If the Sally is as good but less expensive, then I would be willing to try it. Especially since I have a Sally’s nearby!
Posted by mary on 10/29 at 10:22 AM
I went to the Wen website, too and was almost ready to click “order” when, like you Greeneyes, I didn’t want to be locked into a regular buying schedule automatically. Saltnpeppa posted their website and phone number so you could call and try to arrange a different way to buy. Unfortunately, I can’t find that post anywhere!! 
There used to be a way to view all posts by a certain member, but that seems to have disappeared in the glitches we were having. Rats. I’ll check to see if we can have this restored. In the meantime, if any of you remember where this was, please chime in. And, Saltnpeppa, if you’re reading this, could you re-post this info? Thanks!
Posted by Diana Jewell on 10/29 at 10:47 AM
Amazingly enough, I do remember where that post is, now that you mentioned it. I went back and it’s in Talk On - page 14, amidst all of Rosa’s giggling. :o)
Posted by greeneyes on 10/29 at 11:10 AM
Wow—what a memory! I’m gonna go back and mark the website. Thanks, greeneyes.
Posted by Diana Jewell on 10/29 at 11:27 AM
Okay, well...I should fess up. I had totally forgotten about Saltnpeppa’s comment until you mentioned it. Then I remembered I had saved her comment in my email inbox, planning to look at it later. That’s how I knew it was from Talk On… so I went to Talk On and searched it out. Don’t want to be deceitful. :o)
I went on over and emailed WEN, asking if there was a way to order without automatic shipments. I’m waiting for a reply and will let you know if I learn anything.
Posted by greeneyes on 10/29 at 12:33 PM
Okay. This just in. The reply I received. I hope it’s okay to cut and paste it here...I’m sure it’s their standard reply…
Thank you for your inquiry regarding the Chaz Dean WEN Hair Care home delivery program.
By ordering the 30-Day Trial Size Kit at the special price of $29.95, you are enrolled into our home delivery program. One of the benefits of membership is the convenience of automatic shipments. You don’t have to worry about running out! Approximately 30 days after you receive your Trial Size Kit, you will receive your first Full Size Kit. This package is a 90 day supply and will be billed to your credit card account in one payment of $89.85 plus $7.95 shipping/handling, and any applicable sales tax or 3 installment payments of $29.95 each plus $7.95 shipping/handling and any applicable sales tax, added to the first installment payment
Of course, there is no fee for our home delivery program and you may cancel your membership at any time.
If you do not wish to participate in our home delivery program, you may purchase WEN at retail prices.
For any additional information, please contact Customer Service at 1-800-964-1892, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
Posted by greeneyes on 10/29 at 12:38 PM
Thanks, greeneyes. Hmmmmmmm. The approximate $98 every three months might not be so horrible if Wen is the only thing you use. But I like to experiment around, too. Might be smarter to know if you actually LIKE a product before you go into any sort of program. Maybe I’ll call to purchase at retail.
Posted by Diana Jewell on 10/29 at 01:51 PM
I agree. I never like to use only one type of shampoo. I get bored and I think my hair does too. I’m also a bit concerned about the “heaviness” of a product like this. Even the Aveda Dry Remedy makes my hair feel so heavy and blah. I think I’ll probably sit this one out for now.
Posted by greeneyes on 10/29 at 02:31 PM
I am using Jhirmack Silver shampoo and Pantene conditioner (they don’t carry Jhirmack conditioner; duh). I have heard that you should not use these “silverizing” purple-blue products on your hair very often because they dry the hair out. I have not had any problems over and above my normal dryness, but I am wondering, if these products made specifically for my gray hair are not good for it, what on earth IS??? I stopped coloring to save money and time, so I can’t really invest in a pricey product, but if there is something out there that will help, even if I can make it at home, I’d love to know about it. I used Garnier gel on my hair and the Granny Smith apple color showed up really bad on my silver hair. Way too much color in that product; just a heads up ladies. Turned my beautiful silver a yellow-green color, and yes, I only used a dab.
Posted by rocksister on 11/02 at 02:32 PM
rocksister - I agree that it is confusing about shampoos for gray hair. All I know is that Diana teaches us the gray hair shampoos are drying if used too often. I use mine twice a month to brighten my whites, though I don’t have a full head of them. Diana says that white hairs are drier than pigmented, so they need a good moisturizing shampoo and conditioner.
Plus, I’ve heard some of the ladies say their whites have taken on a blue tint when they’ve used the blue shampoos too often.
Have you read the information found under the CARE AND TREATMENT link above? Lots of helpful hair care info.
I’m sure you can still find products wherever you are are currently shopping. In fact, Jhirmack and Pantene may have a good moisturizing shampoo and conditioner you could alternate with your blue shampoo.
Good heads up on the green gel issue. It’s a new way of thinking when taking care of white hair! Sheesh! Guess we have to look for products as color-less as possible.
Posted by greeneyes on 11/02 at 03:07 PM
As promised, I’m reporting in on the “Hair One” product (WEN knock-off) I bought from Sally’s Beauty. I’ve only used it once, so I’ll report back in about a month or so, also.
But I can tell you that I really like it so far. I bought the Cucumber Aloe formula (they have four different types: Tea Tree for Dry Scalp, Olive Oil for Dry Damaged Hair, Jojoba for Color Treated Hair, and the Cucumber Aloe for Normal Hair). It made my hair really soft, less frizzy, and I do think it made straight-ironing it a little easier than usual. While I was using it, it made my scalp feel really cool (almost like it has menthol in it) which was a little different and surprising. I was afraid it might not make my hair feel clean, but it did. You have to use a lot of it, and it takes longer than normal shampoo because the longer you leave it on the better, but so far I like it.
If I really like it and continue to use it, I might try the Olive Oil formula next time. And I’ll also get the Sally’s membership club card and order online. The price online is $10.99, but $9.99 with the club card (which costs $5.00 a year). At the store, the bottle cost me $11.99.
Posted by RunnerGal on 11/02 at 04:34 PM
Thanks RunnerGal for the update on Hair One. I may have to run to Sally’s for a bottle. I do have the club card, though I only got it to save money when I was buying clippers to cut my son’s hair. Maybe I’ll put it to use!
Posted by greeneyes on 11/02 at 06:20 PM
One more thing about Hair One. It said you could use a little as a leave-in conditioner, so what I did was blow dry and straighten my hair, then took a little and blended it in. It worked great. It helped to tame those crazies that stick straight up. And it didn’t make my hair feel greasy. Really nice stuff.
Posted by RunnerGal on 11/03 at 12:51 PM
Sounds good. I have a whole herd of those “crazies”, myself. :o) Some are still dark, but it’s the whites that really light up...a bit like glowing antennae.
Posted by greeneyes on 11/03 at 03:16 PM
Thank you RunnerGal, I’m headed out to my local Sally’s to take a look!
Posted by mary on 11/04 at 06:07 AM
I have been using Pantene Silver Expressions (shampoo and conditioner) and I couldn’t be happier. I’ve been using it for 2 years now and my hair is healthy and growing. But I have trouble picking mousse and I just started using Pantene Shine mousse… still testing. My hair is baby fine which seems odd to say when I have silver white gray hair… but it is. Old face...baby hair… ha ha ha.
Posted by Lynn on 11/10 at 07:18 PM
I’ve seen your pics from Texas, Lynn. NOT an old face!! And beautiful hair!
Posted by Diana Jewell on 11/10 at 09:48 PM
Hi everyone,
I’m new to this Web site but thought I’d jump in. I love it, because I have struggled, for a while, with whether to dye or not to dye. I have come to the conclusion that not dyeing is best. (smile)
Although I’m in my early 50’s, I have short, baby fine hair and a very oily scalp. Consequently, I love clear shampoos without conditioners in them, and I don’t use a conditioner, afterwards, either. The price of the shampoo doesn’t seem to matter as my hair seems to react well to all of these simular formulas.
Peace!
Mary Ellen
Someone asked about a leave-in conditioner. I think Infusion 23 is a pretty good one that doesn’t weigh the hair down.
Posted by Mary Ellen on 11/10 at 10:54 PM
Lynn - Behave yourself! As Diana said, you do NOT have an old face. You look great! And you are vibrant and young and.... bouncy. :o) I guess bouncy is descriptive of your hair, AND probably one of the stories you told reminds me this. :o)
Posted by greeneyes on 11/11 at 08:03 AM
Mary Ellen - Welcome to Diana’s wonderful site.
So, you are ditching the dye!? Good for you! Consider sending in a picture to go into the newbie gallery so we can join in on your transition!
Posted by greeneyes on 11/11 at 08:06 AM
I couldn’t live without conditioner! Lush do great natural conditioners. Jane x
Posted by Jane on 11/11 at 02:18 PM
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